Part 6 - Defending the WT 1956 August 15th Page 504
Does Clement of Alexandria actually say, write or teach that Jesus who was the LOGOS or WORD was "created" IN HIS ACTUAL WRITINGS?
First lets have another look at Photius comments about Clement of Alexandria.
BIBLIOTHECA OR MYRIOBIBLON
109. [Clement of Alexandria, Outlines]
Read three volumes of the works of Clement,1 presbyter of Alexandria, entitled Outlines, The Miscellanies, The Tutor.
The Outlines contain a brief explanation and interpretation of certain passages in the Old and New Testaments. Although in some cases what he says appears orthodox, in others he indulges in impious and legendary fables. For he is of opinion that matter is eternal and that ideas are introduced by certain fixed conditions; he also reduces the Son to something created. He talks prodigious nonsense about the transmigration of souls and the existence of a number of worlds before Adam. He endeavours to show that Eve came from Adam, not as Holy Scripture tells us, but in an impious and shameful manner; he idly imagines that angels have connexion with women and beget children; that the Word was not incarnate, but only appeared so. He is further convicted of monstrous statements about two Words of the Father, the lesser of which appeared to mortals, or rather not even that one, for he writes : "The Son is called the Word, of the same name as" the Word of the Father, but this is not the Word that became flesh, nor even the Word of the Father, but a certain power of God, as it were an efflux from the Word itself, having become mind, pervaded the hearts of men." All this he attempts to support by passages of Scripture. He talks much other blasphemous nonsense, either he or some one else under his name. These monstrous blasphemies are contained in eight books, in which he frequently discusses the same points and quotes passages from Scripture promiscuously and confusedly, like one possessed. The entire work includes notes on Genesis, Exodus, the Psalms, St. Paul's epistles, the Catholic epistles, and Ecclesiasticus. Clement was a pupil of Pantaenus, as he himself says. Let this suffice for the Outlines.
His comments about the TWO "Words" are actually found in his EXTRACTS FROM THEODOTUS as shown below.
GREEK TEXT: "Καὶ ὁ Λόγος σὰρξ ἐγένετο", οὐ κατὰ τὴν παρουσίαν μόνον ἄνθρωπος γενόμενος, ἀλλὰ καὶ "ἐν Ἀρχῇ" ὁ ἐν ταὐτότητι Λόγος, κατὰ "περιγραφὴν" καὶ οὐ κατ' οὐσίαν γενόμενος ὁ Υἱός. 1.19.2 Καὶ πάλιν "σὰρξ ἐγένετο" διὰ προφητῶν ἐνεργήσας. Τέκνον δὲ τοῦ ἐν ταὐτότητι Λόγου ὁ Σωτὴρ εἴρηται. Διὰ τοῦτο "ἐν Ἀρχῇ ἦν ὁ Λόγος, καὶ ὁ Λόγος ἦν πρὸς τὸν Θεόν· ὃ γέγονεν ἐν αὐτῷ, Ζωή ἐστιν"· Ζωὴ δὲ ὁ Κύριος. 1.19.3 Καὶ ὁ Παῦλος· "Ἔνδυσαι τὸν καινὸν Ἄνθρωπον τὸν κατὰ Θεὸν κτισθέντα", οἷον· εἰς αὐτὸν πίστευσον τὸν ὑπὸ τοῦ Θεοῦ "κατὰ Θεόν"τὸν ἐν Θεῷ Λόγον" κτισθέντα". Δύναται δὲ τὸ "κατὰ Θεὸν κτισθέντα" τὸ εἰς ὃ μέλλει τέλος προκοπῆς φθάνειν ὁ ἄνθρωπος μηνύειν ἐπ' ἴσης τῷ "ἀπόλαβε τὸ εἰς ὃ ἐκτίσθης τέλος.". 1.19.4 Καὶ ἔτι σαφέστερον καὶ διαρρήδην ἐν ἄλλοις λέγει· "Ὅς ἐστιν εἰκὼν τοῦ Θεοῦ τοῦ ἀοράτου". Εἶτα ἐπιφέρει· "Πρωτότοκος πάσης κτίσεως". –"Ἀοράτου" μὲν γὰρ "Θεοῦ εἰκόνα" τὸν υἱὸν λέγει τοῦ Λόγου τοῦ ἐν ταὐτότητι· "Πρωτότοκον δὲ πάσης κτίσεως", ὅτι γεν νηθεὶς ἀπαθῶς, κτίστης καὶ γενεσιάρχης τῆς ὅλης ἐγένετο κτίσεώς τε καὶ οὐσίας· "ἐν αὐτῷ" γὰρ ὁ Πατὴρ τὰ πάντα ἐποίησεν. 1.19.5 Ὅθεν καὶ "μορφὴν δούλου λαβεῖν" εἴρηται, οὐ μόνον τὴν σάρκα κατὰ τὴν παρουσίαν, ἀλλὰ καὶ τὴν οὐσίαν ἐκ τοῦ ὑποκειμένου· δούλη δὲ ἡ οὐσία, ὡς ἂν παθητὴ καὶ ὑποκειμένη τῇ δραστηρίῳ καὶ κυριωτάτῃ αἰτίᾳ. (1.19.1-5.)
CLEMENT OF ALEXANDRIA (c 155 - 220 c.e.): "And the Logos became flesh" not only by becoming man at his Advent
, but also" at the beginning" the essential Logos became a son by circumscription and not in essence. And again he became flesh when he acted through the prophets. And the Saviour is called an offspring of the essential Logos; therefore, "in the beginning was the Logos and the Logos was with God" and "that which came into existence in him was life" and life is the Lord. And when Paul says, "Put on the new man created according to God" it is as if he said, BELIEVE ON HIM WHO WAS "CREATED" BY GOD, "according to God," that is, the Logos in God. And "created according to God" can refer to the end of advance which man will reach, as does. . . he rejected the end for which he was created. And in other passages he speaks still more plainly and distinctly: "Who is an image of the invisible God"; then he goes on, "FIRST-BORN OF ALL CREATION." For he calls the Logos (of) the essential Logos "an image of the invisible God," but "FIRST-BORN OF ALL CREATION." Having been begotten without passion he BECAME the creator and progenitor of all creation and substance, for [More correctly (ἐν) "IN" not "BY" quoting Col 1:16] by him the Father made all things. Wherefore it is also said that he "received the form of a servant," which refers not only to his flesh at the advent, but also to his substance, which he derived from its underlying reality, for substance is a slave, inasmuch as it is passive and subordinate to the active and dominating, cause..." - (1.19.1, EXTRACTS FROM THEODOTUS Robert Pierce Casey, The Excerpta ex Theodoto of Clement of Alexandria (Studies and Documents 1; London: Christophers, 1934), 40-91.)
Another reference leaves us in no doubt that Clement believed Jesus as the "Logos of God" was the FIRST-CREATION or "FIRST-CREATED" by God.
GREEK TEXT: "...Τὸ γὰρ "πρὸ ἑωσφόρου ἐγέννησά σε" οὕτως ἐξακούομεν ἐπὶ τοῦ πρωτοκτίστου Θεοῦ Λόγου· καὶ "πρὸ ἡλίου" καὶ σελήνης καὶ πρὸ πάσης κτίσεως "τὸ Ὄνομά σου"..." (1.20.1)
CLEMENT OF ALEXANDRIA (c 155 - 220 c.e.): "...For WE thus understand "I begot thee before the morning star" with reference to THE FIRST-CREATED LOGOS OF GOD and similarly "thy name is before sun" and moon and before all creation..." - (1.20.1, EXTRACTS FROM THEODOTUS Robert Pierce Casey, The Excerpta ex Theodoto of Clement of Alexandria (Studies and Documents 1; London: Christophers, 1934), 40-91.)
Compare this with Proverbs 8:22-31 LXX:
PROVERBS 8:22 GREEK OT: Septuagint with Diacritics: 22 ΚΎΡΙΟΣ ἔκτισέν με ἀρχὴν ὁδῶν αὐτοῦ εἰς ἔργα αὐτοῦ 23 πρὸ τοῦ αἰῶνος ἐθεμελίωσέν με ἐν ἀρχῇ 24 πρὸ τοῦ τὴν γῆν ποιῆσαι καὶ πρὸ τοῦ τὰς ἀβύσσους ποιῆσαι 24 πρὸ τοῦ προελθεῖν τὰς πηγὰς τῶν ὑδάτων 25 πρὸ τοῦ ὄρη ἑδρασθῆναι πρὸ δὲ πάντων βουνῶν γεννᾷ με 26 ΚΎΡΙΟΣ ἐποίησεν χώρας καὶ ἀοικήτους καὶ ἄκρα οἰκούμενα τῆς ὑπ' οὐρανόν 27 ἡνίκα ἡτοίμαζεν τὸν οὐρανόν συμπαρήμην αὐτῷ καὶ ὅτε ἀφώριζεν τὸν ἑαυτοῦ θρόνον ἐπ' ἀνέμων 28 ἡνίκα ἰσχυρὰ ἐποίει τὰ ἄνω νέφη καὶ ὡς ἀσφαλεῖς ἐτίθει πηγὰς τῆς ὑπ' οὐρανὸν 29 καὶ ἰσχυρὰ ἐποίει τὰ θεμέλια τῆς γῆς 30 ἤμην παρ' αὐτῷ ἁρμόζουσα ἐγὼ ἤμην ᾗ προσέχαιρεν καθ' ἡμέραν δὲ εὐφραινόμην ἐν προσώπῳ αὐτοῦ ἐν παντὶ καιρῷ 31 ὅτε εὐφραίνετο τὴν οἰκουμένην συντελέσας καὶ ἐνευφραίνετο ἐν υἱοῖς ἀνθρώπων
NETS-LXX(E): "...The Lord created me as the beginning of his ways, for the sake of his works. 23. Before the present age he founded me in the beginning. 24. Before he made the earth and before he made the depths, 25. before he brought forth the springs of the waters, before the mountains were established, and before all the hills, he begets me. 26. The Lord made countries and uninhabited spaces and the habitable heights of that beneath the sky's. 27. When he prepared the sky, I was present with him, and when he marked out his own throne on the winds. 28. When he made strong the clouds above and when he made secure the springs beneath the sky 29. when he made strong the foundations of the earth, 30. I was beside him, fitting together, it is I who was the one in whom he took delight. And each day I was glad in his presence at every moment, 31. when he rejoiced when he had completed the world and rejoiced among the sons of men..." - A New English Translation of the Septuagint 2007
Look at the parallel:
(LXX) PROVERBS CHAPTER 8, VERSE 24:Add to this:
πρὸ τοῦ τὴν γῆν ποιῆσαι καὶ
BEFORE ( HE ) made the earth and
πρὸ τοῦ τὰς ἀβύσσους ποιῆσαι
BEFORE ( HE ) made the abysses
πρὸ τοῦ προελθεῖν τὰς πηγὰς τῶν ὑδάτων
BEFORE ( HE ) brought forth the springs of the waters
(LXX) PROVERBS CHAPTER 8, VERSE 25:
πρὸ τοῦ ὄρη ἑδρασθῆναι
BEFORE ( HE ) established the mountains
πρὸ δὲ πάντων βουνῶν γεννᾷ με..."
BEFORE of all the hills ( HE ) generated me..."
GREEK TEXT: "...Τὸ γὰρ "πρὸ ἑωσφόρου ἐγέννησά σε"..." (1.20.1)Which both Solomon & Clement of Alexandria understood this "GENERATION" as THE FIRST CREATION BY GOD.
"The (for) "BEFORE of [the] morning star ( HE ) generated you..."
Other possible references, but more not as clear weather it is Clement or Theodotus:
GREEK TEXT: "...πρὸς τοῦ Ἀποστόλου προσαγορεύ εται, "δόξαν ὡς Μονογενοῦς"· –ὅτι εἷς καὶ ὁ αὐτὸς ὤν, ἐν μὲν τῇ κτίσει "Πρωτότοκός" ἐστιν Ἰησοῦς..." (1.7.1)
CLEMENT OF ALEXANDRIA (c 155 - 220 c.e.): "...the Apostle no longer calls " OnlyBegotten," but " as Only-Begotten," "Glory as of an Only-Begotten." This is because being one and the same, Jesus is the" First-Born" in creation..." - (1.7.1, EXTRACTS FROM THEODOTUS Robert Pierce Casey, The Excerpta ex Theodoto of Clement of Alexandria (Studies and Documents 1; London: Christophers, 1934), 40-91.)
GREEK TEXT: "...ἐξ ἀρχῆς ἀπειληφότων τὸ τέλειον ἅμα τῇ πρώτῃ γενέσει παρὰ τοῦ Θεοῦ διὰ τοῦ Υἱοῦ. 1.10.5 Καὶ ὃ μὲν "Φῶς ἀπρόσιτον" εἴρηται, ὡς "Μονογενὴς" καὶ "Πρωτότοκος", "ἃ ὀφθαλμὸς οὐκ εἶδε καὶ οὖς οὐκ ἤκουσεν οὐδὲ ἐπὶ καρδίαν ἀνθρώπου ἀνέβη", οὐδὲ ἔσται τις τοιοῦτος, 1.10.6 οὔτε τῶν Πρωτοκτίστων οὔτε ἀνθρώπων· οἳ δὲ "διὰ παντὸς τὸ Πρόσωπον τοῦ Πατρὸς βλέπουσιν"· Πρόσωπον δὲ Πατρὸς ὁ Υἱός, δι' οὗ γνωρίζεται ὁ Πατήρ..." (1.10.4-6.)
CLEMENT OF ALEXANDRIA (c 155 - 220 c.e.): "...since they have received perfection from the beginning, at the time of the first [Gk., "generation" not "creation" is more accurate] creation from God through the Son. And he is said to be "inapproachable Light" as" Only-Begotten," and "First-Born," "the things which eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, and which have not entered into the heart of man," - and such a one shall not be found either among the First-Created or among men, - but they "always behold the face of the Father" and the face of the Father is the Son, through whom the Father is known..." - (1.10.1, EXTRACTS FROM THEODOTUS Robert Pierce Casey, The Excerpta ex Theodoto of Clement of Alexandria (Studies and Documents 1; London: Christophers, 1934), 40-91.)
But elsewhere in his other works he says the same.
Jesus and surprisingly the "holy spirit" or "paraclete" are both "CREATED".
GREEK TEXT: πρωτόγονοι καὶ πρωτόκτιστοι δυνάμεις
= "first-born (ones) and FIRST-CREATED powers"
= all the words are plural except (καὶ) "and" because of the Grammar rule of Concord or Agreement.
LATIN TEXT: hae namque primitivae virtutes ac primo creatae, inmobiles exsistentes secundum substantiam, cum subiectis angelis et archangelis, cum quibus vocantur equivoce, diversas operationes efficiunt.
CLEMENT OF ALEXANDRIA (c 155 to 220 C.E.): “And if any man sin,” he says, “we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ.” For so the Lord is an advocate with the Father for us. So also is there, an advocate, whom, after His assumption, He vouchsafed to send. For these primitive and FIRST-CREATED virtues are unchangeable as to substance, and along with subordinate angels and archangels, whose names they share, effect divine operations...” - (Fragments, Translated by William Wilson, Collection I, Fragment 3)
The above is found in the ANF by two different names:
Rufinus Latin title: "Adumbrationes" in 1 John 2:1;
Or by it's Greek name "Hypotyposeis" (Ὑποτυπώσεις)
A Greek word that means "sketches, outlines, or drafts," and it was the title of a commentary by Clement of Alexandria (fl. 190s)
So was the Watchtowers first quotation about Clement of Alexandria inaccurate or deliberately lying?
NO GREEK TEXT: As yet. Will provide when aquired.
CLEMENT OF ALEXANDRIA (c 155 - 220 C.E.): "...For He was the Wisdom “in which” the Sovereign God “delighted.” For the Son is the power of God, as being the Father’s most ancient Word..." - (STROMATA: BOOK 7; CHAPTER 2)
GREEK TEXT: 18.104.22.168(b): “...ἀλλ' οἳ μὲν διήκειν διὰ πάσης τῆς οὐσίας τὸν θεόν φασιν, ἡμεῖς δὲ ποιητὴν μόνον αὐτὸν 22.214.171.124 καλοῦμεν καὶ λόγῳ ποιητήν. παρήγαγεν δὲ αὐτοὺς τὸ ἐν τῇ Σοφίᾳ εἰρημένον διήκει δὲ καὶ χωρεῖ διὰ πάντων διὰ τὴν καθαριότητα, ἐπεὶ μὴ συνῆκαν λέγεσθαι ταῦτα ἐπὶ τῆς σοφίας τῆς πρωτοκτίστου τῷ θεῷ...” 126.96.36.199 [“The Stromata”, Book 5, Chapter 14 (XIV) Migne Patrologia]
CLEMENT OF ALEXANDRIA (c 155 - 220 c.e.): “...Well, they say that God pervades all being; while we call Him solely Maker, and Maker by the Word. They were misled by what is said in the book of Wisdom: “He pervades and passes through all by reason of His purity;” since they did not understand that this was said of WISDOM, WHICH WAS THE FIRST OF THE CREATION OF GOD...” - (The Stromata, Book 5, Chapter 14 (XIV))
A better and more literal rendering of the Greek would be:
λέγεσθαι ταῦτα ἐπὶ τῆς σοφίας τῆς πρωτοκτίστου τῷ θεῷ
"That this was said about Wisdom, THE FIRST CREATION OF GOD"
NO GREEK TEXT: As yet. Will provide when acquired.
CLEMENT OF ALEXANDRIA (c 155 - 220 c.e.): “...Why repeat to you the mysteries of wisdom, and sayings from the writings of the son of the Hebrews, the master of wisdom? “The Lord CREATED ME the beginning of His ways, in order to His works.” [Prov. viii. 22.] And, “The Lord giveth wisdom, and from His face proceed knowledge and understanding.” [Prov. ii. 6.] “How long wilt thou lie in bed, O sluggard; and when wilt thou be aroused from sleep?” [Prov. vi. 9.] “but if thou show thyself no 195sluggard, as a fountain thy harvest shall come,” [Prov. vi. 11.] the “Word of the Father, the benign light, the Lord that bringeth light, faith to all, and salvation.” [Prov. vi. 23.] For “the Lord who created the earth by His power,” as Jeremiah says, “has raised up the world by His wisdom;” [Jer. x. 12.] FOR WISDOM, WHICH IS HIS WORD, raises us up to the truth, who have fallen prostrate before idols, and is itself the first resurrection from our fall..." - (Clement of Alexandria Exhortation to the Heathen: Chapter VIII.)
I say no. Definitely not.
What you think is up to you.
Clement of Alexandria on the Generation of the Logos, by H. A. Wolfson 1951 American Society of Church History. Page 72: “...Zahn finds that Clement “always makes a sharp distinction between the only Unbegotten God the Father and the Son or Logos who was begotten or created before the rest of the creation...”
"Clement repeatedly identifies the Word with the Wisdom of God, and yet he refers to Wisdom as the first-created of God; while in one passage he attaches the epithet "First-created," and in another "First-begotten," to the Word. But this seems to be rather a question of language rather than a question of doctrine. At a later date a sharp distinction was drawn between "first-created" and "first-born" or "first-begotten." But no such distinction was drawn in the time of Clement, who with the Septuagint rendering of a passage in Proverbs before him could have no misgiving as to the use of these terms. ...Str., 5.14 Ex. Theod., c.20. Str., vi.7. See Suicer's Thesaurus on PROTOKTISTOS KURIOS EKTISEN ME ARCHEN hODON AUTOU. [Lord (Jehovah) created me first of work of his] Prov 8:22 ... Zahn [in "Supplementum Clementinum: pages 141-147] ... points to the fact the Clement makes a sharp distinction between the Son and the Word who was Begotten or created before the rest of creation and the alone unbegotten God and Father." - "Clement of Alexandria" (Edinburgh: William Blackwood and Sons, 1914; pp. 103, 104) By John Patrick
THE CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA
The dogma of the Trinity
(3) "Expressions which appear to contain the statement that the Son was created are found in Clement of Alexandria (Stromata V.14 and VI.7), Tatian (Address to the Greeks 5), Tertullian (Against Praxeas 6; Against Hermogenes 18-20), Origen (Commentary on John I.22). Clement speaks of Wisdom as "created before all things" (protoktistos), and Tatian terms the Word the "first-begotten work of (ergon prototokon) the Father."..."
APA citation. Joyce, G. (1912). The Blessed Trinity. In The Catholic Encyclopedia. New York: Robert Appleton Company. Retrieved February 11, 2010 from New Advent:
NOTE: Of course the Catholic Encyclopedia goes on to argue for the Trinity, but this is a concession nonetheless.
I also found this from Clement of Alexandria as well:
Fragments of Aristobulus
[Following English translation is from http://www.tertullian.org/fathers or from http://www.tertullian.org/fathers2]
From Clement of Alexandria, Miscellanies 6.16:
GREEK TEXT: "...Τρίτος δέ ἐστι λόγος ὁ μηνύων γεγονέναι πρὸς τοῦ θεοῦ τὸν κόσμον καὶ δεδωκέναι ἀνάπαυσιν ἡμῖν ἑβδόμην ἡμέραν διὰ τὴν κατὰ τὸν βίον κακοπάθειαν· θεὸς γὰρ ἄκμητός τε καὶ ἀπαθὴς καὶ ἀπροσδεής, ἀναπαύλης δὲ ἡμεῖς οἱ σαρκοφοροῦντες δεόμεθα. ἡ ἑβδόμη τοίνυν ἡμέρα ἀνάπαυσις κηρύσσεται, ἀποχῇ κακῶν ἑτοιμάζουσα τὴν ἀρχέγονον ἡμέραν τὴν τῷ ὄντι ἀνάπαυσιν ἡμῶν, ἣ δὴ καὶ πρώτη τῷ ὄντι φωτὸς γένεσις, ἐν ᾧ τὰ πάντα συνθεωρεῖται καὶ πάντα κληρονομεῖται. ἐκ ταύτης τῆς ἡμέρας ἡ πρώτη σοφία καὶ ἡ γνῶσις ἡμῖν ἐλλάμπεται· τὸ γὰρ φῶς τῆς ἀληθείας φῶς ἀληθές, ἄσκιον, ἀμερῶς μεριζόμενον πνεῦμα κυρίου εἰς τοὺς διὰ πίστεως ἡγιασμένους, λαμπτῆρος ἐπέχον, τάξιν εἰς τὴν τῶν ὄντων ἐπίγνωσιν. ἀκολουθοῦντες οὖν αὐτῷ δι’ ὅλου τοῦ βίου ἀπαθεῖς καθιστάμεθα, τὸ δέ ἐστιν ἀναπαύσασθαι. διὸ καὶ Σολομὼν πρὸ οὐρανοῦ καὶ γῆς καὶ πάντων τῶν ὄντων τῷ παντοκράτορι γεγονέναι τὴν σοφίαν λέγει, ἧς ἡ μέθεξις (ἡ κατὰ δύναμιν, οὐ κατ’ οὐσίαν λέγω) θείων καὶ ἀνθρωπίνων καταληπτικῶς ἐπιστήμονα εἶναι διδάσκει..." (Misc. 6:16)
CLEMENT OF ALEXANDRIA (c 155 - 220 c.e.): “...And the third [or fourth] word is that which intimates that the world was created by God, and that He gave us the seventh day as a rest, on account of the trouble that there is in life. For God is incapable of weariness, and suffering, and want. But we who bear flesh need rest. The seventh day, therefore, is proclaimed a rest-abstraction from ill"-preparing for the Primal Day, our true rest; which, in truth, is the first creation of light, in which all things are viewed and possessed. From this day the first wisdom and knowledge illuminate us. For the light of truth-a light true, casting no shadow, is the Spirit of God indivisibly divided to all, who are sanctified by faith, holding the place of a luminary, in order to the knowledge of real existences. By following Him, therefore, through our whole life, we become impossible; and this is to rest. Wherefore Solomon also says, that before heaven, and earth, and all existences, Wisdom had arisen in the Almighty; the participation of which-that which is by power, I mean, not that by essence-teaches a man to know by apprehension things divine and human..."
In my opinion this is not translated clearly enough or it is one of dozens and dozens of deliberate miss-translations by biased Trinitarian translators. Making it obscure on purpose.
I have seen to much of this in the ANF for there to be any doubt.
GREEK TEXT: "...διὸ καὶ Σολομὼν πρὸ οὐρανοῦ καὶ γῆς καὶ πάντων τῶν ὄντων τῷ παντοκράτορι γεγονέναι τὴν σοφίαν λέγει..." (Misc. 6:16)
CLEMENT OF ALEXANDRIA (c 155 - 220 c.e.): “...Wherefore also Solomon says: "...before Heaven and Earth and all things existing the Almighty brought into being the Wisdom..." - Translated by Matt13 weedhacker (23/8/2010)
CLEMENT OF ALEXANDRIA (c 155 - 220 c.e.): “...Wherefore also Solomon says: "...before Heaven and Earth and all things existing the Almighty brought into existence Wisdom..." - Translated by Matt13 weedhacker (23/8/2010)
CLEMENT OF ALEXANDRIA (c 155 - 220 c.e.): “...Wherefore also Solomon says: "...before Heaven and Earth and all things existing the Almighty created Wisdom..." - Translated by Matt13 weedhacker (23/8/2010)
CLEMENT OF ALEXANDRIA (c 155 - 220 c.e.): “...Wherefore also Solomon says: "...before Heaven and Earth and of the entire universe the Almighty created Wisdom..." - Translated by Matt13 weedhacker (12/10/2010)
Henry George Liddell, Robert Scott, A Greek-English Lexicon
I. abs., come into being opp. εἶναι, Emp.17.11, Pl.Phd.102e, cf. Ti.29a; and so,
1. of persons, to be born, ...
2. of things, to be produced, “ὅσα φύλλα καὶ ἄνθεα γίγνεται ὥρῃ” Od.9.51; opp. ὄλλυσθαι, Parm.8.13,40; opp. ἀπόλλυσθαι, Anaxag.17, cf. Pl.R.527b, etc.; opp. ἀπολείπειν, Diog. Apoll.7; opp. ἀπολήγειν, Emp.17.30; “τὰ γιγνόμενα καὶ ἐξ ὧν γίγνεται” Pl.Phlb.27a; ... so in Math., of products, “ὁ ἐξ αὐτῶν γενόμενος ἀριθμός” Euc.7.24 ...
In my experience, those who hate Jehovah's Witnesses will not change their veiws, no matter how much proof is put before them.
We will continue in another post with the second comment about Clement of Alexandria later.